This Difficulty Retarget Problem
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To get miners back on board the difficulty MUST drop. I know because i’m a miner with 15MH/s and a huge electric bill and hardware costs. As much as i want to help FTC, by mining it now i’ll be throwing away $1000s per month.
In a few hours LTC diff will fly up 25% so all the miners (me included) will be looking for the next most profitable coin which will likely be cnc (ftc’s direct competitor as far as i can tell) but possibly trc or ppc or… Of course this means that there will be renewed interest in CNC and other alts. Then the LTC diff will drop again, rinse and repeat. Basically no-one will be interested in ftc. Every time i click the stats page we add a day to the re-target and the hash rate drops. we’ll never get there!
Honestly, we need to act quickly me thinks. Pref before the LTC diff increase.
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[quote name=“Nutnut” post=“2113” timestamp=“1368182060”]
To get miners back on board the difficulty MUST drop. I know because i’m a miner with 15MH/s and a huge electric bill and hardware costs. As much as i want to help FTC, by mining it now i’ll be throwing away $1000s per month.In a few hours LTC diff will fly up 25% so all the miners (me included) will be looking for the next most profitable coin which will likely be cnc (ftc’s direct competitor as far as i can tell) but possibly trc or ppc or… Of course this means that there will be renewed interest in CNC and other alts. Then the LTC diff will drop again, rinse and repeat. Basically no-one will be interested in ftc. Every time i click the stats page we add a day to the re-target and the hash rate drops. we’ll never get there!
Honestly, we need to act quickly me thinks. Pref before the LTC diff increase.
[/quote]Even so, with 15mH/s you could make a big difference even if it meant 1 month at break even (obviously not loss) - But hey I do understand you not wanting to, it’s only logical if you are in it to profit short term.
I do agree something needs to be done pronto, as even sending Feathercoin and waiting for 1 confirm is now taking longer than sending BTC and waiting for 6. :o -
If we went for a 504 difficulty adjust we need to work out how much the difficulty will be adjusted. We do not want the overall effect to be drastically different, we want to end up with a more fine grained difficulty adjust. I have made a couple of rough tables below comparing the difficulty value when it goes up.
Normal difficulty adjust
0…2016 Block count
4 …16 Difficulty going up 400%504 difficulty adjust
0…504…1008…1512…2016 Block Count
4…5.6…7.84…10.96…15.36 Difficulty going up by 140%
4…6…9…13.5…20.25 Difficulty going up by 150%
4…8…16…32…64 Difficulty going up by 200%
4…16…64…256…1024 Difficulty going up by 400% -
I have to confess i’m not entirely sure how the whole fork thing works (and i’m no coder) but, if we do fork, what are we suggesting? Resetting the difficulty manually or just changing the re-target block?
Can we have a variable re-target block based on hash rate? plucking a figure from the air say 126 blocks per GH/s working on a 150% diff change? or am i talking drivel?
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[quote name=“UKMark” post=“2128” timestamp=“1368185055”]
[quote author=Nutnut link=topic=305.msg2113#msg2113 date=1368182060]
To get miners back on board the difficulty MUST drop. I know because i’m a miner with 15MH/s and a huge electric bill and hardware costs. As much as i want to help FTC, by mining it now i’ll be throwing away $1000s per month.In a few hours LTC diff will fly up 25% so all the miners (me included) will be looking for the next most profitable coin which will likely be cnc (ftc’s direct competitor as far as i can tell) but possibly trc or ppc or… Of course this means that there will be renewed interest in CNC and other alts. Then the LTC diff will drop again, rinse and repeat. Basically no-one will be interested in ftc. Every time i click the stats page we add a day to the re-target and the hash rate drops. we’ll never get there!
Honestly, we need to act quickly me thinks. Pref before the LTC diff increase.
[/quote]Even so, with 15mH/s you could make a big difference even if it meant 1 month at break even (obviously not loss) - But hey I do understand you not wanting to, it’s only logical if you are in it to profit short term.
I do agree something needs to be done pronto, as even sending Feathercoin and waiting for 1 confirm is now taking longer than sending BTC and waiting for 6. :o
[/quote]I agree but it’s the people with 15Mh/sec hash power that caused the problems in the first place, I’m gonna lose some dollars on electricity, yeah because all miners like you left us to clean up this mess.
Short term indeed
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We need to address the Retarget Problem [b]now[/b].
This is no religion, this is the market. Users will not mine Feathercoin because they [i]believe[/i] in it - they will mine it because it’s profitable.
[b]So we have to get difficulty down ASAP!
[/b]
Additionally (long term) we either have to build up an infrastructure of shops, sites, services, etc. that accept Feathercoin. -
[quote name=“Radacoin” post=“2144” timestamp=“1368189976”]
We need to address the Retarget Problem [b]now[/b].This is no religion, this is the market. Users will not mine Feathercoin because they [i]believe[/i] in it - they will mine it because it’s profitable.
[b]So we have to get difficulty down ASAP!
[/b]
Additionally (long term) we either have to build up an infrastructure of shops, sites, services, etc. that accept Feathercoin.
[/quote]Well some of us believe in it, otherwise I would be mining LTC or CNC right now, but agree we need services, and the total-hashrate needs to go tenfold for this to be workable, because at the minute even sending FTC is taking forever.
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I agree, some of us do this because we believe in it, not because we’re trying to make a profit, although that may be a nice bonus.
Are the two approaches somewhat mutually exclusive? I’m beginning to think they are personally…
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[quote name=“Radacoin” post=“2144” timestamp=“1368189976”]
We need to address the Retarget Problem [b]now[/b].This is no religion, this is the market. Users will not mine Feathercoin because they [i]believe[/i] in it - they will mine it because it’s profitable.
[b]So we have to get difficulty down ASAP!
[/b]
Additionally (long term) we either have to build up an infrastructure of shops, sites, services, etc. that accept Feathercoin.
[/quote]True, some of us are actually already contacting webmasters about adopting Feathercoin in their webshop.
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[quote name=“Armandoke” post=“2142” timestamp=“1368189939”]
[quote author=UKMark link=topic=305.msg2128#msg2128 date=1368185055]
[quote author=Nutnut link=topic=305.msg2113#msg2113 date=1368182060]
To get miners back on board the difficulty MUST drop. I know because i’m a miner with 15MH/s and a huge electric bill and hardware costs. As much as i want to help FTC, by mining it now i’ll be throwing away $1000s per month.In a few hours LTC diff will fly up 25% so all the miners (me included) will be looking for the next most profitable coin which will likely be cnc (ftc’s direct competitor as far as i can tell) but possibly trc or ppc or… Of course this means that there will be renewed interest in CNC and other alts. Then the LTC diff will drop again, rinse and repeat. Basically no-one will be interested in ftc. Every time i click the stats page we add a day to the re-target and the hash rate drops. we’ll never get there!
Honestly, we need to act quickly me thinks. Pref before the LTC diff increase.
[/quote]Even so, with 15mH/s you could make a big difference even if it meant 1 month at break even (obviously not loss) - But hey I do understand you not wanting to, it’s only logical if you are in it to profit short term.
I do agree something needs to be done pronto, as even sending Feathercoin and waiting for 1 confirm is now taking longer than sending BTC and waiting for 6. :o
[/quote]I agree but it’s the people with 15Mh/sec hash power that caused the problems in the first place, I’m gonna lose some dollars on electricity, yeah because all miners like you left us to clean up this mess.
Short term indeed
[/quote]Tell me honestly - if you had 15MHs at your disposal that cost you about £8500 + running costs etc, what would you do with it? Mine a non profitable coin? i think not! FTC NEEDS full time miners as does everycoin. Stabilise the difficulty and we’ll stay!
As Radacoin says miners mine because of profits and as I have previously stated, we ARE a ruthless lot and we will mine the most profitable coin. It up to the DEVELOPERS to make the coin much less vulnerable to people hopping in and out. The fact i’m here making some suggestions as to how to improve the coin should tell you that i’m a believer but i do have bills to pay and i would loose $1000s per month - it’s just not an option…
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[quote name=“UKMark” post=“2145” timestamp=“1368190558”]
[quote author=Radacoin link=topic=305.msg2144#msg2144 date=1368189976]
We need to address the Retarget Problem [b]now[/b].This is no religion, this is the market. Users will not mine Feathercoin because they [i]believe[/i] in it - they will mine it because it’s profitable.
[b]So we have to get difficulty down ASAP!
[/b]
Additionally (long term) we either have to build up an infrastructure of shops, sites, services, etc. that accept Feathercoin.
[/quote]Well [b][color=red]some of us[/color][/b] believe in it, otherwise I would be mining LTC or CNC right now, …
[/quote]But those are the minority (just look at the continuously decreasing network hashrate). And they are getting less by the minute.
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[quote name=“Nutnut” post=“2148” timestamp=“1368191044”]
Tell me honestly - if you had 15MHs at your disposal that cost you about £8500 + running costs etc, what would you do with it? Mine a non profitable coin? i think not! FTC NEEDS full time miners as does everycoin. Stabilise the difficulty and we’ll stay!
As Radacoin says miners mine because of profits and as I have previously stated, we ARE a ruthless lot and we will mine the most profitable coin. It up to the DEVELOPERS to make the coin much less vulnerable to people hopping in and out. The fact i’m here making some suggestions as to how to improve the coin should tell you that i’m a believer but i do have bills to pay and i would loose $1000s per month - it’s just not an option…
[/quote]I second that.
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[quote name=“Nutnut” post=“2148” timestamp=“1368191044”]
[quote author=Armandoke link=topic=305.msg2142#msg2142 date=1368189939]
[quote author=UKMark link=topic=305.msg2128#msg2128 date=1368185055]
[quote author=Nutnut link=topic=305.msg2113#msg2113 date=1368182060]
To get miners back on board the difficulty MUST drop. I know because i’m a miner with 15MH/s and a huge electric bill and hardware costs. As much as i want to help FTC, by mining it now i’ll be throwing away $1000s per month.In a few hours LTC diff will fly up 25% so all the miners (me included) will be looking for the next most profitable coin which will likely be cnc (ftc’s direct competitor as far as i can tell) but possibly trc or ppc or… Of course this means that there will be renewed interest in CNC and other alts. Then the LTC diff will drop again, rinse and repeat. Basically no-one will be interested in ftc. Every time i click the stats page we add a day to the re-target and the hash rate drops. we’ll never get there!
Honestly, we need to act quickly me thinks. Pref before the LTC diff increase.
[/quote]Even so, with 15mH/s you could make a big difference even if it meant 1 month at break even (obviously not loss) - But hey I do understand you not wanting to, it’s only logical if you are in it to profit short term.
I do agree something needs to be done pronto, as even sending Feathercoin and waiting for 1 confirm is now taking longer than sending BTC and waiting for 6. :o
[/quote]I agree but it’s the people with 15Mh/sec hash power that caused the problems in the first place, I’m gonna lose some dollars on electricity, yeah because all miners like you left us to clean up this mess.
Short term indeed
[/quote]Tell me honestly - if you had 15MHs at your disposal that cost you about £8500 + running costs etc, what would you do with it? Mine a non profitable coin? i think not! FTC NEEDS full time miners as does everycoin. Stabilise the difficulty and we’ll stay!
As Radacoin says miners mine because of profits and as I have previously stated, we ARE a ruthless lot and we will mine the most profitable coin. It up to the DEVELOPERS to make the coin much less vulnerable to people hopping in and out. The fact i’m here making some suggestions as to how to improve the coin should tell you that i’m a believer but i do have bills to pay and i would loose $1000s per month - it’s just not an option…
[/quote]Like I said I can understand why you do it…Although you seem to mixing up, [i]profit[/i] with [i]loss [/i]and [i]greater profit[/i].
I would not mine at a loss, but I would mine for less profit, there is a difference, at the current rate of exchange I’m above break even = profit. Granted not at the level of profit of LTC but still at profit not total loss. -
[quote name=“Radacoin” post=“2150” timestamp=“1368191200”]
[quote author=Nutnut link=topic=305.msg2148#msg2148 date=1368191044]Tell me honestly - if you had 15MHs at your disposal that cost you about £8500 + running costs etc, what would you do with it? Mine a non profitable coin? i think not! FTC NEEDS full time miners as does everycoin. Stabilise the difficulty and we’ll stay!
As Radacoin says miners mine because of profits and as I have previously stated, we ARE a ruthless lot and we will mine the most profitable coin. It up to the DEVELOPERS to make the coin much less vulnerable to people hopping in and out. The fact i’m here making some suggestions as to how to improve the coin should tell you that i’m a believer but i do have bills to pay and i would loose $1000s per month - it’s just not an option…
[/quote]I second that.
[/quote]By overmining these coins you guys shoot yourself in the foot and always need to hop to other coins, but sooner or later you’ll have destroyed the diff’s for most coins and then u can throw the systems away I guess.
I doubt we’ll ever agree on this, but imho the top miners destroy to much by focussing al their hash powers on alt coins.
You can spread your hashing power and still make a fair profit -
How much time does a transfer take?
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Until the hardware is paid for, it’s all a loss. The longer it takes to recover the costs the less the resale value on kit is so the loss gets bigger.
Would you go to work for £100 per day when someone else was offering you £200 per day for [b]exactly[/b] the same job? Both would be profitable but i bet my shirt you’d take the £200 option? If not you’re bonkers!
FTC needs more than my hashing power to succeed.
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[quote name=“omnom” post=“2153” timestamp=“1368191941”]
How much time does a transfer take?
[/quote]on d2.cc pool there is a block that has 1 confirmation left from 120 and it has been found 3 days ago… http://ftc.d2.cc/statsAuth block 32486
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[quote name=“omnom” post=“2153” timestamp=“1368191941”]
How much time does a transfer take?
[/quote]It [i]did[/i] take a couple of minutes, but I’m still waiting on one confirm from nearly 6 hours ago :'(
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How many of you have your wallets open and incoming connections permitted?
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[quote name=“Nutnut” post=“2154” timestamp=“1368192063”]
Until the hardware is paid for, it’s all a loss. The longer it takes to recover the costs the less the resale value on kit is so the loss gets bigger.Would you go to work for £100 per day when someone else was offering you £200 per day for [b]exactly[/b] the same job? Both would be profitable but i bet my shirt you’d take the £200 option? If not you’re bonkers!
FTC needs more than my hashing power to succeed.
[/quote]Fair do’s I must admit I was overlooking the initial outlay, but surely if I have paid my £500 outlay back with 1.3mH/s you must be well on your way?
And FTC needs a damn sight more than mine, I know that lol :)
