Difficulty Discussion - Fork Update - Bushstar
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Forking has not proved to be a major problem in the past. Bitcoin has gone through this sort of thing in the past, more recently Terracoin went through two forks resolving their difficulty adjust. Freicoin is planning its own fork very soon. Without the occasional fork it is not possible to make some upgrades and tweaks like we are planning to do.
To upgrade you would copy the content of the zip file over your existing files. Or delete the FeatherCoin folder and extract the new one.
Your wallet is not located in the same folder as the Feathercoin client. Just to be safe make sure that you have backed up your wallet somewhere.
[b]Backup on Windows[/b]
Go to Start -> Run (or press WinKey+R) and run this:
[quote]explorer %APPDATA%\Feathercoin[/quote]
Feathercoin’s data folder will open. For most users, this is one of the following locations:
[quote]C:\Documents and Settings\YourUserName\Application data\Feathercoin (Windows XP)C:\Users\YourUserName\Appdata\Roaming\Feathercoin (Windows Vista and 7)[/quote]
If you have trouble browsing to these folders, note that “AppData” and “Application data” are hidden by default.The file you need to backup is called wallet.dat. I suggest you add it into a passworded zip file before copying it to Dropbox, USB stick or somewhere else. When you back up the file make sure you copy it and do not move it.
To restore your wallet to another computer you run Feathercoin and close it again. Browse to the above directory and copy the backed up wallet.dat over the newly generated one. Then you would run the wallet using the -rescan option to make it recheck all transactions in the block chain.
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I like the idea of being a [i]specital.[/i] ;)
Something to do while people watch, I suppose. lol
Ugh almost 1am, time to set I18 again and crash… I should invest in ear plugs lol
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[quote name=“DigitalDoom” post=“2796” timestamp=“1368380247”]
where to get the new client?Also…where is the FTC website? I went to Feathercoin.org and it’s the YACoin site…which makes no sense at all!
EDIT:
NM about the site…found it @ Feathercoin.com. Still pretty sh1tty that feathercoin.org is YACoin.com
[/quote]You are on the site ;) Just click [i]About[/i] above ^^ :)
And YACoin obviously need to Scam people into their coin under the name of Feathercoin ::) -
By the way Feathercoin.org has nothing to do with us. Someone bought up all the domains and pointed them to some pretty offensive material to start with.
Anyway there is no need to update yet. When you need to update we will announce it here, on BitcoinTalk and stick information on the stats page.
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[quote name=“DigitalDoom” post=“2802” timestamp=“1368383706”]
[quote author=UKMark link=topic=363.msg2797#msg2797 date=1368380914]
[quote author=DigitalDoom link=topic=363.msg2796#msg2796 date=1368380247]
where to get the new client?Also…where is the FTC website? I went to Feathercoin.org and it’s the YACoin site…which makes no sense at all!
EDIT:
NM about the site…found it @ Feathercoin.com. Still pretty sh1tty that feathercoin.org is YACoin.com
[/quote]You are on the site ;) Just click [i]About[/i] above ^^ :)
And YACoin obviously need to Scam people into their coin under the name of Feathercoin ::)
[/quote]K, thanks.
I just installed the client on the site, is that the new one…the one we need for the fork?
[/quote]It’s the latest one yes, but the one required for the fork has not been released yet. You will know when it has by checking this forum for its announcement and it will be available from the homepage ([i]About [/i]link above^^) of this site. :cool:
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[quote name=“ChristianRiesen” post=“2733” timestamp=“1368354328”]
I would strongly advise against the fork. To give you a sample of the browser world: IE 6 still lives. That Zombie wont die. Getting everyone, every last person, to switch will not be an easy task and there will be stragglers, people downloading it from old links and mirrors, etc.
[/quote]#1. People think IE is a part of the computer. They don’t update.
#2. Morons in IT still build for it. So no one feels pressured to update.
#3. IE is a browser for the WHOLE INTERNET. No one wants their browsing experience to change drastically.
#4. IE does not tell you to update nor does Microsoft visit its forums and beg people to update.We behave exactly opposite. Stragglers will download so as to be able to continue sending money. Being lenient will only encourage laziness, which is precisely the problem with IE. Microsoft feels no pressure to support standards because the users show no interest in a better experience for the developer even if it would mean much less cost.
[quote]
My second point against it is that it is premature. Just a reminder, the difficult is set to plummet from 188 to 22. That drop will make the traffic on FTC skyrocket again.
[/quote]Going down over 20 days is not plummeting. It’s constipation.
The reason for the fork is the amount of time necessary for it to adjust. 20 days if 700 MHs is the average, the difficulty changed about 5 days ago. But we only have 350 MHs. That means it’s actually 40 days. And the difficulty will drop again after that for another week.
No. One. Wants. To. Wait. 40. Days. When. They. Can. Make. Profit. Tomorrow. Elsewhere. So. That. 40. Days. Becomes. 80. Days.
To get people to come back you would need the difficulty to change at the latest in the next 5 days. 40 days / 5 days = 8. You would need NEARLY EIGHT TIMES the users to get the difficulty to change. But then the difficulty wouldn’t be 22. It would be more like 88. Which is only a 2x gain over what it is now, and then it would go back up. And this would happen again.
This situation is a pretzel. Pretzels don’t loosen by themselves.
[quote]
Look at bitcoin, the difficulty skyrocketed in the past 2 months alone. Nobody talks about a hard fork there (and is taken serious).
[/quote]And So. Did. The. Price. And then BTC crashed and Bitcoiners came to us. The people who are kicking FTC are former BTCers. They are not NEW PEOPLE.
[quote]
I for one will keep building my mining rigs and let them push onward. We can cut those days down with our raw power and dedication to the coin :)
[/quote]You can only cut those days down with math. Raw power isn’t enough.
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This may be of interest. It is a Bitcoin hard fork wish list. I have to wonder if the change to the block hashing algorithm would stop current ASICs from working.
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[quote name=“Bushstar” post=“2827” timestamp=“1368388760”]
This may be of interest. It is a Bitcoin hard fork wish list. I have to wonder if the change to the block hashing algorithm would stop current ASICs from working.https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Hardfork_Wishlist
[/quote]That would have been legen…waitforit…dary
Just the expression on all the asics owners face=P -
[quote name=“Bushstar” post=“2827” timestamp=“1368388760”]
This may be of interest. It is a Bitcoin hard fork wish list. I have to wonder if the change to the block hashing algorithm would stop current ASICs from working.https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Hardfork_Wishlist
[/quote]Application Specific v Changed Specification
Hmm, might well throw a spanner in the works :o -
[quote name=“archminer” post=“2746” timestamp=“1368359937”]
Can’t agree more. And I agree that you should take your time to come up with the best solution. However in the meanwhile please update the stats page to tell people that you care, and you are preparing a solution, and therefore the next difficulty adjustment is not months away. This will give people confidence, and it will help spread the word that a new version is upcoming, so that when it actually comes out more people will know about it and the transition will be more smooth.
IMHO you should also link to the life support thread in the stats page, to show people not only the devs care, the community cares too.
[/quote]Observation : Over at bitcointalk, I haven’t seen a feathercoin post on page one of alternate cryptocurrencies in 2 days. I can’t post there yet, but I read there a lot and was surprised.
There was a lot of negative talk about FTC in the other topics however. So I agree with the above statement 100%. If I were unaware of this forum and were holding FTC … I’d probably think it vanished if I did nothing other scan page one of alternate cryptocurrencies [url=https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?board=67.0]https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?board=67.0[/url].
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[quote name=“DigitalDoom” post=“2830” timestamp=“1368389391”]
[quote author=Bushstar link=topic=363.msg2827#msg2827 date=1368388760]
This may be of interest. It is a Bitcoin hard fork wish list. I have to wonder if the change to the block hashing algorithm would stop current ASICs from working.https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Hardfork_Wishlist
[/quote]We could only hope for such a thing.
Of course, it wouldn’t be long before adjustments were made and ASICs were back in action…just like it’s only a matter of time before they are taught to mine scrypt.
Would be hilarious though to see the panic from those who paid a fortune on multiple ASIC hashing monsters.
[/quote]If it can be done via software that is and doesn’t require a whole new IC :o
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[quote name=“Tuck Fheman” post=“2836” timestamp=“1368389597”]
[quote author=archminer link=topic=363.msg2746#msg2746 date=1368359937]Can’t agree more. And I agree that you should take your time to come up with the best solution. However in the meanwhile please update the stats page to tell people that you care, and you are preparing a solution, and therefore the next difficulty adjustment is not months away. This will give people confidence, and it will help spread the word that a new version is upcoming, so that when it actually comes out more people will know about it and the transition will be more smooth.
IMHO you should also link to the life support thread in the stats page, to show people not only the devs care, the community cares too.
[/quote]Observation : Over at bitcointalk, I haven’t seen a feathercoin post on page one of alternate cryptocurrencies in 2 days. I can’t post there yet, but I read there a lot and was surprised.
There was a lot of negative talk about FTC in the other topics however. So I agree with the above statement 100%. If I were unaware of this forum and were holding FTC … I’d probably think it vanished if I did nothing other scan page one of alternate cryptocurrencies [url=https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?board=67.0]https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?board=67.0[/url].
[/quote]Consider the quality of conversation in the alt currency section, I don’t know if this is a bad thing. Once Bush gets us back on track with the fork, we’ll have plenty to talk about. We have so many projects already wrapping up, we’re about to show them Feathercoin is the trend.
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[quote name=“Bushstar” post=“2827” timestamp=“1368388760”]
This may be of interest. It is a Bitcoin hard fork wish list. I have to wonder if the change to the block hashing algorithm would stop current ASICs from working.https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Hardfork_Wishlist
[/quote]From : [url=https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Hardfork_Wishlist]https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Hardfork_Wishlist[/url] …
[quote]Difficulty adjustment periods should overlap (prevent potential ‘timejacking’) Note: An ideal adjustment algorithm would ensure there is no easy dispute on “next target” for any block. Eg, [i][b]it should not be possible for MinerX to set his block time 2 hours in the future to achieve a slightly higher difficulty and win any same-block-height race by default[/b][/i]. [/quote]
This [i][b]is[/b][/i] possible currently?
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@Tuck I highly doubt that’s possible. It’s a network remember. Most of the network would reject such blocks. I don’t think it would even work on pools. You can’t just set your own difficulty and expect the network to honor it.
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The discussion page was interesting on the bitcoin hardfork wishlist, especially this part …
[url=https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Talk:Hardfork_Wishlist#Proposals_which_reduce_security]https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Talk:Hardfork_Wishlist#Proposals_which_reduce_security[/url]
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[quote name=“zerodrama” post=“2852” timestamp=“1368392168”]
@Tuck I highly doubt that’s possible.
[/quote]Which makes me even more curious. Why does it need to be fixed?
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[quote name=“Tuck Fheman” post=“2857” timestamp=“1368392760”]
[quote author=zerodrama link=topic=363.msg2852#msg2852 date=1368392168]
@Tuck I highly doubt that’s possible.
[/quote]Which makes me even more curious. Why does it need to be fixed?
[/quote]Highly intelligent crypto geeks, thinking up the impossible possible, so it has to be fixed :)
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[quote name=“Tuck Fheman” post=“2857” timestamp=“1368392760”]
[quote author=zerodrama link=topic=363.msg2852#msg2852 date=1368392168]
@Tuck I highly doubt that’s possible.
[/quote]Which makes me even more curious. Why does it need to be fixed?
[/quote]My bad. I read it backwards. The idea being that you could fake the timing of a block to make it seem like you worked harder when there is a dispute over blocks that are the same length as others. I still think it’s difficult, but it’s an interesting thing to look at.
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Hi
I do not know all the specs of the coins but using my logic, why not simply take the min between 2016 block or 3 days after the last change. I remembered that the difficulty use to increase ever 2 or 3 days so I think it is a reasonnable delay ?
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@zerodrama: I get the different view, but it seems to me that there are two colliding world views. Those that think 20 days is an eternity that makes feathercoin die a horrible death, and the rest.
Difficulty is an equalizer. I don’t know your background, so please don’t take offense if I make this a bit simpler. Currency markets work on the same basic principle of supply and demand like everything else, just a bit more abstracted. With cryptos it gets even more abstract (and technical where even people who know about the subject get knots in their brains). The difficulty slows down (or speeds up) the generation of currency, which both means the value can rise and fall with it, like a normal currency would. If you look at some of the many sites that track the coins and their values, you will see patterns that are close mirrors to what other currencies went through.
My overall approach (and again, just my humble opinion) is to sit it out. This in my view will be much better for the coin and its stability than anything else.
