The attack is over and we can thank automatic coin choice pools
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[quote name=“Tuck Fheman” post=“12034” timestamp=“1370829371”]
[quote author=jeremiel link=topic=1463.msg12023#msg12023 date=1370828277]
[quote author=Tuck Fheman link=topic=1463.msg12001#msg12001 date=1370826406]
There is another side. Because of this event miners are now getting twice what they were, sooner.I know it’s no consolation, but there is an actual benefit (not to mention price, more miners, stronger network) you can attribute to this event.
[/quote]
yeah that would work if miners could actually mine. Also, it benefits just the pump and dumpers so you have just given a middle finger to the long haul people.
[/quote]I’m not sure how pointing out a benefit can be associated with me [i]“giving a middle finger”[/i] to anyone, especially [i]“long haul”[/i] people considering my circumstances.
But I respect your right to have your own opinion.
[/quote]
I stated this earlier in the week about not making this stuff about the pump and dumpers(p/ds). Most of the people keeping FTC afloat were the smaller miners, not the 5MH or higher. Now the p/ds will bring a lot of hash power but they will leave at a moments notice(ryc, cnc, mnc). Typically, with the high hash rates in a pool people get less especially if they are smaller. With the block adjustment a high hash rate can move a pool quickly and the smaller miners see none of those gains. Now longterm we need those high hashes but the marketplace needs to exist to truly encourage that properly.A good hash rate max for a pool seems to be around 100mh after that it gets weird. A higher difficulty would of course justify a higher hashrate thus adjusting this…
The best solution I see for all of this is a massive push for many smaller pools, thus less concentration, and a centralized reference to see that those pools exist that way a quick spot check of legitimate pools can be seen during an attack. Of course my opinion as a small miner…
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[quote name=“DaMooMoo” post=“12055” timestamp=“1370830830”]
[quote author=stulowe link=topic=1463.msg12050#msg12050 date=1370830249]
[quote author=Tuck Fheman link=topic=1463.msg12044#msg12044 date=1370829936]
[quote author=stulowe link=topic=1463.msg12037#msg12037 date=1370829567]
[quote author=Tuck Fheman link=topic=1463.msg12034#msg12034 date=1370829371]
[quote author=jeremiel link=topic=1463.msg12023#msg12023 date=1370828277]
[quote author=Tuck Fheman link=topic=1463.msg12001#msg12001 date=1370826406]
There is another side. Because of this event miners are now getting twice what they were, sooner.I know it’s no consolation, but there is an actual benefit (not to mention price, more miners, stronger network) you can attribute to this event.
[/quote]
yeah that would work if miners could actually mine. Also, it benefits just the pump and dumpers so you have just given a middle finger to the long haul people.
[/quote]I’m not sure how pointing out a benefit can be associated with me [i]“giving a middle finger”[/i] to anyone, especially [i]“long haul”[/i] people considering my circumstances.
But I respect your right to have your own opinion.
[/quote]Long term people as in supporters. Those who propped up the mining rate and kept the coin from dying at a loss for themselves and want to see the coin do well for the coins sake. Not the long term bag holders who bought in when it was high before and have been sniffing around the forum pretending to support until they can make their money back.
[/quote]Oh well, ya got me! I’ve never mined FTC a day in my life and have never purchased under .004 and I spend all my time here trying to drive the price up to make back the vast empire I have lost investing too high.
Ok, gigs up guys I’m out!
[/quote]That wasn’t targeted at you.
Be good to get some confirmation on what’s going on with the pools. is fcpool.com on the wrong chain now?
[/quote]
d2 pool seems to be having a lot of problems. I cant maintain a connection to the pool, and the pool isn’t finding any blocks. I have shifted some of my mining power to p2pool for the moment.I would love to hear from Bushstar and zerodrama and what their thoughts are on the whole situation. But I understand they are probably trying to get some rest.
[/quote]
D2 was one of my backups and I can’t connect… -
[quote name=“whenhowwho” post=“12064” timestamp=“1370831373”]
FTC is still an infant and you do not choke a baby because it filled its diaper.
[/quote][img]http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Nicolas-Cage-Laugh.gif[/img]
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I would love to attract smaller miners. I’m even willing to put up some type of major contest to support it. Please hit me with specific ideas and I’ll run it across our contest lead.
Like everyone here, I want solutions.
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[quote name=“whenhowwho” post=“12064” timestamp=“1370831373”]
Ok so there was an attack. That is to be expected. What i did not expect was my dogs to stop my mining while i was at a graduation party and buying a house. We will get through it just as we got through the abysmally high difficulty. I am not worried and I will continue to mine even though my pool currently is charging an outrageous fee.if you happen to run the pool that I mine on. First off I love your pool. Second smack yourself. Seriously, high five yourself in the face. I have been paying a fee already and donating some extra if your “hot wallet” could not handle the abuse after all the fees that you have already collected as well as the donations (there are many donators) then you are doing it wrong. We both know that at some point you must have oversold your FTC which is what put you in the situation you are in the first place. Put the fee back to what it was and stop your nonsense.
Now that I have gotten that off my chest. Back to the subject at hand. Forking the chain is and always has been a bad idea. Do not do it. Attacks are to be expected and there is very little that can be done. That is the reality. It all sorts itself out eventually. FTC is still an infant and you do not choke a baby because it filled its diaper.
[/quote]Pools should NEVER trade with user coins.
From my point of view accepting such an attack is insane, but well it is not my coin so i will follow the main devs decision…
We will drop Feathercoin PPS Support for now. We jumped back on the attackers chain, like everybody else.
I am asking myself for what checkpoints are made for?..but anyways… happy mining …
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[quote name=“hynodeva” post=“12107” timestamp=“1370833384”]
[quote author=whenhowwho link=topic=1463.msg12064#msg12064 date=1370831373]
Ok so there was an attack. That is to be expected. What i did not expect was my dogs to stop my mining while i was at a graduation party and buying a house. We will get through it just as we got through the abysmally high difficulty. I am not worried and I will continue to mine even though my pool currently is charging an outrageous fee.if you happen to run the pool that I mine on. First off I love your pool. Second smack yourself. Seriously, high five yourself in the face. I have been paying a fee already and donating some extra if your “hot wallet” could not handle the abuse after all the fees that you have already collected as well as the donations (there are many donators) then you are doing it wrong. We both know that at some point you must have oversold your FTC which is what put you in the situation you are in the first place. Put the fee back to what it was and stop your nonsense.
Now that I have gotten that off my chest. Back to the subject at hand. Forking the chain is and always has been a bad idea. Do not do it. Attacks are to be expected and there is very little that can be done. That is the reality. It all sorts itself out eventually. FTC is still an infant and you do not choke a baby because it filled its diaper.
[/quote]Pools should NEVER trade with user coins.
From my point of view accepting such an attack is insane, but well it is not my coin so i will follow the main devs decision…
We will drop Feathercoin PPS Support for now. We jumped back on the attackers chain, like everybody else.
I am asking myself for what checkpoints are made for?..but anyways… happy mining …
[/quote]+1
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[quote name=“zerodrama” post=“11980” timestamp=“1370823780”]
The attacker isn’t trying to profit.The attacker wants us to reverse.
That will kill FTC because it would hurt legitimate miners and buyers and sellers especially when we are opening the market.
Stop worrying about the attacker making money. They want to waste their money to hurt us and then we’re going to hurt our users?
[/quote]
A million times this.I understand the desire to try and do something to stop the attackers’ supposed profit, but what people have been discussing doing would do far more harm to the reputation of FTC than any harm it would do to the attackers. Yes, 51% attacks are a problem. However, drastic actions will not solve the problem. As zerodrama has said, he is working on ways to combat this. Anyone can put a band-aid on a problem; good solutions take time.
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solution: keep mining 8)
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[quote name=“whenhowwho” post=“12064” timestamp=“1370831373”]
if you happen to run the pool that I mine on. First off I love your pool. Second smack yourself. Seriously, high five yourself in the face. I have been paying a fee already and donating some extra if your “hot wallet” could not handle the abuse after all the fees that you have already collected as well as the donations (there are many donators) then you are doing it wrong. We both know that at some point you must have oversold your FTC which is what put you in the situation you are in the first place. Put the fee back to what it was and stop your nonsense.
[/quote]If its the same pool I’m on then it’s to basically get people off the pool.
I too donate. after doing so, found there was no ‘faster’ donor pool anyway, but meh, no biggie. But now it’s about what… a total of 10% to mine there.
Nah, I make less than 20 coins a day at the current difficulty. and with all this shit going on, I have no idea what pools are good, grumpy, bad, or crazy.
as for having multiple pools set up in my miner, that’s like asking me to spread a teaspoon of butter on a dozen loaves of bread and expect it to stick. between 120 confirms or over 20 hours to confirm it’s just not reasonable.
im just going to close my eyes and forget about it, leave it go… sfa else I can do about anything…
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[quote name=“zerodrama” post=“11919” timestamp=“1370817760”]
Give Me FTC shut off withdrawals. This has effectively killed the attack.Because of the high hashrate the attacker was also overwhelmed by automatic coin choice pools.
The result was that many scrypt miners turned to FTC which snowballed. The attacker still managed to get some coin. But again this shows that a 51% injection and a full attack are different things.
To fully attack you must:
Gain 51% of the mining power.
SUSTAIN the 51% mining power.
Orphan legitimate block generation.
Get people to confirm your blocks.There is a misconception that mining helps the attacker. Yes, it helps the attacker to confirm some of his false coins. BUT, as soon as the rest of the network reaches higher rate than his, the ledger gets reorganized.
This would have been a hell of a lot worse without automatic coin choice pools. They routed a ton of hashpower at FTC. This broke the attacker’s control of the blockchain.
[/quote]On behalf of Multipool, you’re welcome.
But seriously, we did not have the hash rate to match the attackers, even when the multiport switched to FTC.
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It’s like Oprah here today.
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[quote name=“Mogumodz” post=“12185” timestamp=“1370841682”]
It’s like Oprah here today.
[/quote]Do we get free gifts? I’ve looked under my chair, but no luck.
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[quote name=“Tuck Fheman” post=“12186” timestamp=“1370841774”]
[quote author=Mogumodz link=topic=1463.msg12185#msg12185 date=1370841682]
It’s like Oprah here today.
[/quote]Do we get free gifts? I’ve looked under my chair, but no luck.
[/quote]No sorry, attacker took them so we have none :(
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Attacker(s) took out Coinchoose yesterday as well.
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Just want to say - I dropped support for FTC after I found out about the block reward - but after this attack - I’d just like to say i want to help in any way possible - obviously FTC is enough of a threat to warrant it - so if there is any way in which we/i can help FTC , i’d like to .
and enemy of an enemy is a friend to me ! :D
who is the main Dev of FTC these days?
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[quote name=“erk” post=“12281” timestamp=“1370856205”]
Just to make it clear, I don’t believe that the automated coin choice pools had anything to do with the attack, I believe the title of this post is misleading and provocative.[/quote]
I think almost everyone here believe the choice pools are what saved us from a potential worst case scenario. If events didn’t transpire the way they did (FTC becoming so profitable at the same time the attacks took place) we would have had a much bigger mess to clean up. I also understand how you may view the post title as misleading, but the opening post is not misleading whatsoever. -
[quote name=“digitalindustry” post=“12288” timestamp=“1370857261”]
Just want to say - I dropped support for FTC after I found out about the block reward - but after this attack - I’d just like to say i want to help in any way possible - obviously FTC is enough of a threat to warrant it - so if there is any way in which we/i can help FTC , i’d like to .and enemy of an enemy is a friend to me ! :D
who is the main Dev of FTC these days?
[/quote]Good to have you :), the main Dev is Bushstar.
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[quote name=“erk” post=“12281” timestamp=“1370856205”]
Just to make it clear, I don’t believe that the automated coin choice pools had anything to do with the attack, I believe the title of this post is misleading and provocative.
[/quote]I said automated coin choice pools HELPED us.
For those people who say, “So nothing will be done?”
Reactionary solutions are worse than nothing.
We are doing something. We are innovating to make this much more difficult to carry out.
We are not going to panic and hurt legitimate miners. We will create and improve. Punishment for the guilty is just a crutch that doesn’t solve the problem.The attacker does NOT CARE about punishment. They want the coin to die. There is no deterrent for these people. They have money and bitcoin to burn. They will kill us with brute force or loss of confidence.
They do not care if they lose money.
They do not care if their attack fails.
They want us to lose faith and confidence.
They want us to disappear.The more we react against attacks, instead of preventing them and improving the coin, the weaker we are.
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I’m from a political socioeconomic background so let me give you guys a little education - :
1. work on sCrypt FPGA or ASIC -
2. Spam out “Alt coins” < that you made and control < to spread the base of the smaller miners while they chase after all the spam.3. concentrate you ASIC or FPGA # power.
4. Attack the weakest at the time with the aim to destroy [b][i]Confidence in the unit and entity [/i][/b]
this all = attack is from people with lots of capital caught up in Bitcoin and ASICS.
there are two parts to the confidence vector , [i][b]Traders Confidence and miners Confidence.[/b][/i]
I think the Devs made the right decision as Trading is the life and death.
I will now mine FTC and I may have never before , so the attack may have blow back as it may bring a lot of attention to FTC , plus FTC is low enough in price that i can significantly benefit anyhow .
it sounds like the idea that was had of many pools with 100MH limits could help?
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https://www.cryptsy.com/ delisted FTC - says it’s “hidden” in the twitter update
